Does Kirkbymoorside need a supermarket?

Have you noticed this question seems to be coming up in conversations in the town in recent weeks? There’s a lot of conjecture about whether there are plans for one alongside the new housing development in Russell’s Yard – can anyone clarify that?

I’m sure most people will have a view on the matter, one way or the other, so I thought I would both invite your thoughts via the comment box below and run a totally unscientific poll which you can participate in – it’s near the top of the right hand column. I’ll run the poll for a month so do let us know what you think.

Oh by the way you can only vote once!

If time allows I hope to be about town talking to people about their thoughts on the issue and will hopefully post some vox pop videos over the next few weeks.

So what do you think?…..

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55 Responses to Does Kirkbymoorside need a supermarket?

  1. Jean Richards September 15, 2011 at 9:42 pm #

    Just voted ‘no’ for several reasons. KMS already has two mini (if not super) markets. We aren’t a big enough community to merit a big supermarket, so what we would get would be another along the lines of the Spar or Co-op – is there enough custom to keep three such places in business? And if it is at Russell’s Yard, it will take shoppers away from the town centre and the smaller independent shops, which I value and want to see continue.

    But discussion is always good. Anyone going to argue for the ‘yes’ vote?

  2. Anonymous September 21, 2011 at 9:52 am #

    Tesco announces plans will be available for view in the library at Kirkbymoorside shortly.

  3. Sian September 21, 2011 at 9:57 pm #

    No, I don’t think it does need a supermarket. We already have everything we need in the independent shops in the market place, it will just draw business away from them – the chemist, baker, butcher etc will all lose so much trade because of it. We have the Spar and the Coop which have so far served the community perfectly adequately. As a small traditional market town, Kirkbymoorside will lose its charm.
    So no, I hope it doesn’t go through.

  4. mrs walker September 22, 2011 at 3:36 pm #

    yes, i think we do need a supermarket,not only will it create 100 jobs,it will stop anymore houses built there.as for taking custom away from the town its self, i think if you have a loyal customer base then why worry, i use supermarkets in york but still use all the shops up the street,for daily items such as fruit n veg,chemist,the bakery,paper shop, not everyone would choose tescos to shop in ,but why not give us all a choice.i also think if customers come to use the tesco store from surrounding villages then they might use our town for the rest of their shopping rather than going to pickering or helmsley.i hope it has childrens clothes to buy as we really do need a shop for clothes instead of more antique shops, hairdressers and charity shops.it could also help the youngsters in kirkbymoorside through sponsership deals,lets think about the future generations.

  5. Anonymous September 22, 2011 at 4:00 pm #

    I wonder Mrs Walker whether you would continue to use those local shops if you could get your fruit and veg, bread, newspapers, aspirin in one place ….Tesco’s. It may be 100 jobs but how many will we lose as our High Street is decimated?

  6. mrs walker September 22, 2011 at 8:48 pm #

    in answer to your question, yes i would ,as i have always supported our local shops, i have been a resident of kirkbymoorside for the past 40 years.oh and i never but fruit n veg from a supermarket, i like to see and feel what im buying and know where it comes from.

  7. Anonymous September 22, 2011 at 9:11 pm #

    I am for the supermarket plans for Kirkbymoorside. I am a working Mum who never gets chance to go to the market, saturday mornings are impossible to find a SAFE free parking space and as everyone is ,we have a budget for shopping which is less and less every month as prices get higher. I would love to have the time to park some where in town and walk round the shops and buy local, good quality produce but the reality is I dont have the time or the money. Also the fact that travelling to Malton or York to shop is increasingly expensive has to be taken into account.A tesco store will save my household ££ every week and that is My main concern.

  8. Anonymous September 22, 2011 at 11:14 pm #

    kirkbymoorside needs tesco and a white horse public house

  9. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 8:10 am #

    kirkbymoorside..a small market town..with all the houses been built i think not

  10. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 12:20 pm #

    yes…get more people into Kirbymoorside and jobs for local people!

  11. Mr E September 23, 2011 at 1:03 pm #

    Yes we do… but increasing footfall onto the high street is key to supporting existing businesses, if people come from out of town to Tesco, they may use the bank or post office while here, they will pass Strickland’s and the antiques shops, bookshop, pubs, cafes and restaurants and they may decide to call into West End DIY instead of driving to B&Q at Clifton Moor.

    Look at market towns like Driffield and Market Weighton, both have these have small Tesco just outside the high street, but the areas between are busy and vibrant because of footfall going from one to the other, and hopefully replicating this vibrancy would encourage more shops to open here rather then Helmsley or Pickering which could lead to further jobs and opportunities for the community.

    Clearly local money is already been spent out of town in supermarkets or online, given the number of online delivery vans cluttering up the town regularly, so why not keep that money in the community so local business can benefit off the back of it. I believe, that as a community, this can be an opportunity for us, if done right, improve kirkbymoorside.

    When we come to talk about community, it’s not just about shops, its wider then that, how close did we come to losing the library? Do you think that a local Tesco would not support the local schools or sports clubs? And where do you work if you live here and have childcare responsibilities, or like me, don’t drive or rely solely on costly, cut service public transport?

    So, why don’t we listen, get the facts and then make a decision. IF we need to object we can but why not see if we can influence and make sure we get the best deal for all of Kirkbymoorside as a community!

    • m Roberts March 5, 2014 at 11:39 am #

      If it is to be a small Tesco, how are they going to employ 100 people! That sounds very unlikely. If they do sell everything that anyone would want what will happen to the butcher the baker, the bank, Bains , Towlers , the paper shop etc etc etc. We have almost all we need including a weekly market.
      Will they all close down as all the staff and customers move to Tescos and we shall be left with antiques, hair stylists and charity shops and no work for the people who worked there?

  12. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 1:44 pm #

    Need to be careful here about impressions rather than facts. An independent report commissioned by East Riding Council has the following quotes about Market Weighton: Market Weighton is a traditional market town with a linear town centre. The opening of the Tesco supermarket on Southgate in 2007 has brought new trade into the town as a whole. Tesco is located outside the existing town centre boundary but it is close to the town centre and so is included in the floorspace for the town centre which is rated as good overall. However, the consultation workshop was concerned that the town centre appears to be quiet on most days and trade has fallen since the opening of Tesco, particularly at the north end of the town centre. Our analysis of the household survey results on market shares of main stores suggests that Tesco’s performance in terms of sales density is below its company average level. The results also suggest that convenience goods turnover of other shops in Market Weighton has declined since the opening of Tesco.The workshop thought that Market Weighton town centre appears to be quiet on most days. There is a lack of footfall. In our view the volume of pedestrian flow in the town centre is generally poor. It is busiest in the main retail core area of the High Street but poorer at the eastern and western ends of the centre, including Southgate. Tesco does not appear to generate any significant pedestrian movement and the consultation group reported that: Tesco feels physically divorced from the rest of the town centre and there is a need to investigate ways of creating a better connection between Tesco and the town centre and increase footfall. We agree that it is important to improve linkages between Tesco and the town centre in order to help the centre benefit from linked trips. Tesco could lead to further losses of trade from food shops in the town centre.

  13. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 2:34 pm #

    well said mr e, i totally agree.

  14. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 3:59 pm #

    Thanks to Mr E for presenting a balanced argument. I think it’s very easy for the older more economically ‘comfortable’ members of the town to dismiss the supermarket idea before a meeting with the proposers has even happened, however as a 20 year old I feel it’s a shame that you should need reminding that Kirkby has a hugely varied demographic, and surely this should be considered.
    Not everybody is able to have a leisurely stroll through town on a Wednesday, but this doesn’t mean that they should be forced to pay convenience store prices in the Co-op or the Spar. It’s these very same young working people who will be the ambassadors of this town one day, however their (my) opinion is being overlooked in favour of those of you who are already respected members of the town. I do wonder how many young people know about this blog and the chance to vote, and I also wonder whether anybody plans to get their opinion on the matter, or are we to be over-looked again?
    Another point that is important to make is rather than vilify Tesco’s (I’m sure you’ve all shopped there at one time or another), why not ask what they may be prepared to do within our town and community to support us. The whole point of the meeting is to share ideas and opinions, there is NO POINT scaremongering and spreading negative ideas before any of us have heard the facts.
    I love Kirkbymoorside, as home, but also just as a small market town. We have never been a tourist hub like Helmsley, and in my opinion we never will be, so why not have faith in what we do already have to offer, and improve upon it. That way we will be of interest to the local shoppers AND tourists much more so that we already are.

  15. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 5:55 pm #

    We need Tesco, more local jobs and save travelling 15 miles – best thing that’s happened 2 the town…….. If it don’t happen here it will happen somewhere else And then won’t everybody moan that KMS get nothing……….!! Bring it on!!!

  16. Anonymous September 23, 2011 at 8:24 pm #

    Let’s not be mistaken here – Tesco is not coming for the benefit of Kirkbymoorside – rather it’s to mop up any trade from Northern Ryedale. Sure, people will probably come from Helmsley and maybe even Pickering but they have their own butchers bakers DIY and fruit and veg shops. Why would they suddenly choose to walk up the town and use those in Kirkby? It’s more likely they’ll visit Tesco then go home.

    The local shops in Kirkby provide a good service and are a real asset to the town. Despite the new houses being built Kirkby remains a small town and there is only so much money around to be spent locally. Even a small change in spending patterns within our town will have a major impact on the profitability of some of our shops and inevitably some will close down with job losses as a result.

    I can understand some of the views in favour of the supermarket but lets not pretend eveything will be rosy. Times are hard, but they are also hard for our independent shops – please think about the prospect of empty shops in the heart of the town. Who would choose to invest in a business with Tesco as a competitor? By all means have a debate but we have to consider the possibilty that our town would become a ghost town. Is that a price worth paying?

  17. Anonymous September 24, 2011 at 10:08 am #

    Regarding the post above, i’m not so sure, personally if i go to co-op in Pickering, i will walk into the high street and use the thomas’s, chemist, grocers or butchers while there if i need to. i would be unlikely to make another trip into town once back, unless i had forgot something

  18. Anonymous September 24, 2011 at 5:52 pm #

    Just because there may be a Tesco here, all of you opposed to it wouldn’t be forced to shop there, so what’s the problem if you’ll all continue to use the high street?

    I’m imagining that most people use a combination of local shops and the supermarkets in Malton, York etc. If that is the case, the places that would be impacted most would be the larger towns that currently we all waste petrol(impacting the environment) travelling to.

    I can personally say that so far I am a massive supporter of the plans for a Tesco, but I can also say that I will continue to use the treasure cove that is Baines’s, the chemist, occasionally Something Special and Busy Liz’s. Just as I use the shops on the high street in Malton when I visit Morrisons. Why would people travelling to Kirkby not visit the high street, after spending petrol money to get here?

    I do understand that the thought of such a major competitior is worrying, but business IS competition and change ISN’T always a bad thing. The number of potential customers for the high street shops could be increased tenfold- use it as an opportunity, promote yourselves better, offer products people want at reasonable prices. Do what you have to so that people want to buy what you’re offering… is it that hard?

  19. Anonymous September 24, 2011 at 7:41 pm #

    what a relief that at last we are seeing comments on the blog from younger members of the town, good well balanced ideas about the proposed tesco…and the comment above is spot on in my opinion.

  20. Mrs C September 25, 2011 at 9:45 am #

    We think that it is a very good idea to have a Tesco, lets not kid ourselves Kirkbymoorside is NO LONGER a small market town! I must point out the fact that Baines fruit and veg shop had very little regard for the damage they did to Roy and Diane Humbles’ shop on Piercy End, and they HAVE lived in KMS for many years! The COOP sells Newspapers and this has no effect on Kirkby News whatsoever, The Coop and spar also sell meat and veg which also doesn’t effect the local shops. Tesco is simply another choice for us to have, freedom of choice is something Kirkby hasn’t had, especially for those who don’t drive. It is always the same in Kirkby, it is full of do gooders who have plenty of cash to splash around and do not even consider families on a REAL budget. The point is YOU don’t have to shop there if you don’t want to. KMS doesn’t have a decent bus service to get to other areas like Malton, and York. It is ridiculous to suggest that people will not come into the town anymore, if anything it will attract more people to look around, come on people move with the times and look to the future of our wonderful town in a positive light, there are just some people who are opposed to everything in Kirkby and they are the dinosaurs that need to be weeded out!!!!!

  21. Mr E September 25, 2011 at 11:45 am #

    In response to Anon (23.9.11, 13:44)…you are right my comments about Market Weighton are based on my impression not fact and I will freely admit it was based on my experiences a few years back, things may have changed for the worse (or better). However, having just located and read the report you mention (http://www.eastriding.gov.uk/corp-docs/forwardplanning/docs/retail/volume3/market_weighton.pdf) I note it says “ the consultation workshop was concerned that the town centre appears to be quiet on most days and trade has fallen since the opening of Tesco”, isn’t that just their impression, there doesn’t seem to be quantative data. The same report also says “The
    opening of the Tesco supermarket on Southgate in 2007 has brought new trade
    into the town as a whole.”

    It would be useful for discussion to provide links to original documents referred to in posts to aid discussion.

  22. Anonymous September 25, 2011 at 12:16 pm #

    There is a report on the Action for Market Towns website (which appears to be a charitable organisation that represents the interests of market towns) and they have ERYC study on Beverley.

    Their website says “Interestingly, there is no evidence ‘on the ground’ that Tesco has had a negative effect in its first year of trading. On the contrary, it appears to have made a positive contribution to the health of the town centre. No closures of convenience goods shops are directly attributable to the opening of Tesco. The overall health of that part of the town centre closest to Tesco appears to have remained strong and even to have improved since the opening of the store.”(http://towns.org.uk/2009/07/22/impact-of-an-edge-of-town-tesco-store/)

    The full story and the full study can be found via link above.

    An updated report on Beverley linked to the market weighton report mentioned above can be found at http://www.eastriding.gov.uk/corp-docs/forwardplanning/docs/retail/volume3/beverley.pdf

    And it appears that Driffield also had a generally positive experience http://www.eastriding.gov.uk/corp-docs/forwardplanning/docs/retail/volume3/driffield.pdf

    For anyone interested these retail study reports can all be found athttp://www.eastriding.gov.uk/corp-docs/forwardplanning/html/retail.html

  23. Miss F September 25, 2011 at 3:05 pm #

    yes, I feel that Kirkbymoorside needs a supermarket, yes we do already have a coop and a spar, but there isn’t very much variety in the freezer sections, and they are always changing what produce they sell, like some are only on offer to buy if its a promotion product.. on offer.. it will also bring trade to the town like people have said you know yourself when you go to do your weekly/monthly shop at Malton, Scarborough or York, you tend to browse the local shops around the area too, and make an outing of it.

  24. Mrs M September 25, 2011 at 6:06 pm #

    I think a tesco in Kirkby is a fantastic idea, and i am sick of hearing from certain people that we dont want or need it, i have lived here all my life, i am now in my 40’s, and i think it is great news for us, why should i be told where i want and need to shop? I want to have the choice!!! Only this morning i had a walk to the Co-op for a joint of meat to cook for Sunday roast only to find there wasnt one joint of meat in the fridge, we then had to set off to Pickering to get it, a 14 mile round trip, i just hope all these older “set in there ways” type of people do not get there way on this one, thats why i shall definately be attending the public exhibition next week to show my support, i suggest everyone else in favour of a supermarket does too, lets not let these dinosaurs spoil it for our town!!

  25. Anonymous September 25, 2011 at 7:10 pm #

    Great to here the views from the town….please town council Listen,the people Want to choose where they shop….far too much misinformation and scaremongering already ….well said Mrs M & C,Democracy must win this time.

  26. Anonymous September 25, 2011 at 8:20 pm #

    Would it not help to ask Tesco at the presentation, if planning permission is granted what they can do for the Town…ie what about a sign on entry to the site telling visitors what we have to offer in kirkby…how about helping with christmas lights etc……lets go forward in partnership? ,it can be done..

  27. mr m September 25, 2011 at 9:15 pm #

    bring tesco s on it has got to be good for the town . this town is crying out for a decnt place to shop the spar is dirty and in need of updating. the people need a choice and tesco can help out there. the job prospects are just what is needed and will be a welcome boost to the town.people have got to move with the times the town has missed out on so many things over the years and this could be another if we dont get posotive about tesco s coming to town.things just seem to stand still , if we dont get a tesco pickering or malton will then people will be moaning about having to travel and sayin we dont get anything. have a long hard think about this it is a great oppotunity for this town and the people who live here.

  28. Gareth Jenkins September 25, 2011 at 10:17 pm #

    hi editor of the blog here. First thank you to everyone for voting and leaving your comments. It’s turning out to be a lively debate which is great – it raises many issues and enlightens us to other viewpoints. It’s been reasonably accommodating on that score but please allow others to have different views without accusing them of this that or the other. Or make assumptions about them; wealth, class, newcomer etc If you live here you are entitled to an opinion. And, judging by the response, we feel passionate about it.
    OK – as Mr A, Miss B, Mrs C, Anonymous, the Sage and others have left their opinion here’s mine. I wasn’t going to say anything, try and remain neutral because of my role here but as I’m talking to friends and acquaintances about the issue, as I’m sure you all are, then it seems a little daft not to join in the discussion here!This town is the best place I have ever lived – (before anyone says why is your house on the market it’s just we want a bigger garden and, if it ever sells, we will be looking to stay). One of the great things about the town is it’s strong sense of community. The huge range of activities and the wonderful volunteers that run them. The great services – the post office, the dentist, the doctors, the school and nursery, the sports provision and yes….the shops. I value the fact that we have a distinct and welcoming High Street which is so different from many, many other places that have become bland and full of the same shops staffed by people who are simply on the payroll and without a personal stake in it’s future. I value that I can go into Towlers and talk to Rory about my mother’s tablets but also about his next gig with the Kirkby Soul band and his wife Jo about play area issues. I value I can get local produce from Rosemary Wass’s farm at Baines and excess produce from the allotments can be bought there too. I value I can talk to Marie about which paint and stain I should use and that she’ll kindly give us a prize for a charity raffle or a free pot of paint for the scout roof. I love the fact that the town is buzzing on a Wednesady market and that so many people enjoy catching up with the friends or if they are lonely can just sit and watch the world pass by. I could go on but the heart of the town is our High Street and the people who pass by there every day. Friends coming to the town for the first time always remark on it’s diversity and say how lucky we are …. I agree.

    I’m not an opponent of change and I don’t believe that the town should become a fossil of a byegone age but I do think we need to be very careful about making changes that may, over time, slowly but surely suck the lifeblood from our High Street. We should make our decision based on knowing the potential gains balanced against the potential losses. The only way to do that is to look at what has happened elsewhere in market towns of our size and reflect what the likely outcome will be here. I don’t think the ‘bring it on’ or ‘Tesno’ approach is fair to those whose views may differ from our own. Once we have some sense of what the realistic scenario is for our town not only in terms of High Street shop impact but traffic congestion/ sound levels, future A170 retail developments, employment etc then we can decide which way to go with an understanding of what the implications will be. And yes, that means some independent work needs to be done and this will need to be funded. The alternative is ill-informed prejudice and that’s not a good enough basis for decision-making on something as important as this. The feedback has been great for raising issues – parking problems, lack of choice, agreed poor quality of Spar provision and so on. It makes me think some kind of retail survey would be a good thing to do anyway. So let’s take our time on this and give it due consideration. I may be a newcomer of just 12 years in this town but I have lived in many other places and none compare to this lovely town.

  29. Mal September 26, 2011 at 1:29 am #

    Gareth – I was born and brought up in Kirkbymoorside and I still have relatives living in the town so I am a regular visitor and share your views that it is a wonderful place. During my life I have moved around with my work and so have experienced living in quite a few places, not only in the UK but also abroad. I remember quite well that when I lived in Bishops Cleeve which is only about 3 miles out of Cheltenham, just the other side of the famous racecourse in fact, there were concerns about a Tesco megastore (24 hour opening) in addition to the existing Safeway. Guess what ? The local shops in the village continued to exist and actually flourished after the opening of the Tesco store. All this was despite the fact that it was only a few minutes by car or bus into Cheltenham with several other large supermarket chains. What it did provide was choice. In addition it provided free parking for up to two hours which allowed people to wander around and explore what the rest of the place had to offer. I now live in Boroughbridge, and have done for several years, the high street in the town/village has a good range of small family run shops providing a wide range of services despite the very large Morrisons store which attracts shoppers from as far away as Teesside. When I last checked a few hours ago we still had 3 butchers, 1 chemists, 2 bakers, 3 cafes, 1 hardware store, 1 SPAR, 1 wine merchant/off license, 2 newsagents, 1 electrical and household goods store plus a wide range of other types of high street businesses such as gift shops, florists, clothing shops and the like. It has done no harm here and I very much doubt that it would do any damage in Kirkby either. Kirkbymoorside is in danger of falling by the wayside and becoming a sleepy little dormitary village for Malton/Pickering and the proposed Tesco store might just be the kick up the backside that the place needs to bring some life and vibrancy back.

  30. Anonymous September 26, 2011 at 7:56 am #

    I’m torn over this issue – on the positive side, I do think that a supermarket will bring more people to the town, provide local jobs and more choice for local residents. I think that Kirkby’s wonderful sense of local community will mean that the people who already shop locally will continue to do so and perhaps use the new store for those things you’d usually have to travel for. Those people who would usually drive to Malton or York may well choose to stay local instead, making more use of the independent shops. It will be a challenge for existing local traders, but we have some great shops and I’m sure the good ones will rise to it.
    My big problem is that it’s Tesco – an unethical monster of a superstore chain which has a huge monopoly on the grocery market in the UK (27% – over a quarter) and exploits its farmers and suppliers ruthlessly. A shame the Co-op didn’t take advantage of the site and create a bigger, better store of their own…

  31. Anonymous September 26, 2011 at 1:40 pm #

    For anyone with mobility issues an accessible supermarket without steps or aisles clogged with boxes and additional displays is going to make life much easier. It will also help those shopping with young children

  32. Anonymous September 26, 2011 at 2:36 pm #

    it would be interesting to know if all the people who are against the new supermarket have ever shopped in a tesco/asda/morrisons, if they have then it must be just they dont want one here , but dont mind them been built in someone else’s town….

  33. Mr E September 26, 2011 at 5:45 pm #

    Regarding the post by Anon (25.9.11, 20:20), great idea but I was actually thinking of going wider then this, I would have thought those examples were a given, as would be donations to local sports clubs (there are plenty of examples of donations of £500 at store opening on the internet). How about advertising Kirkbymoorside as a place to shop on any leaflets they put out as well as signage?

    Why not try for something a bit more, Somersham, a plastic bag free zone, negotiated a deal with the store on selling the villages cloth bags and funding continues in turn to go back into the community everytime one is sold, (http://www.huntspost.co.uk/news/business-news/somersham_s_tesco_express_opens_as_plastic_bag_free_shop_1_1014395) couldn’t the Enviromental group look into this surely it ties into the “transition town”, maybe Kirkbymoorside could become famous as a carbon neutral town, we could go further and ask them to pay for wind turbines to power the town (I think I remember seeing a refurbished water mill on a TV programme a few months back that was doing this for its community). Or how about getting them to fund an updated telephone exchange bringing high speed broadband to the town, this may bring in developing e-businesses to town bringing more opportunity and employment (by the way I have no idea on the costs of these, whether they are feasible, achievable or viable).

    I have to agree with Mr M (25.9.11 21:15), I would be more worried as a local shop keeper if we stopped the proposal here and it was subsequently built at Pickering or Helmsley, not only could I still potentially lose the local trade but I wouldn’t gain the linked trade, that to me would be more scary!

    Gareth, I for one, thank you for and welcome your contribution, as a resident, obviously, you are fully entitled to your own opinion and I don’t think your role as editor prevents you from voicing that here along with everyone else and in fairness your post contained some sound advice and I agree an independent survey of the residents would be really helpful, maybe something else we could ask Tesco to fund, though we would have to make sure it was truly independent and unbiased (from all sides).

    As for Anon’s concerns (26.9.11 07:56), yes I appreciate where your coming from and I assume a lot of our negative thoughts will centre on this aspect, but whether there is a store here or not, or if they never built another store, Tesco’s Corporate social responsibility policy is unlikely to change overnight, and maybe change only happens if we make them address the issues and get them to put things in place one store and one community at a time, so we can show them what we, as a community and prospective customers, are concerned about and value.

    And then above, Today, another sensible point by Anon, one I had not considered, on the equality and accessibility offered by a modern store and given the demographic of our community that has to be given strong consideration.

    Oh and a point to check at the public exhibition…some of these really small stores don’t appear to have bakers, they have “bake off”, which from how it was described, is a small selection of part cooked products that are “baked off” in store, which I guess is a bit like what co-op have? So I can’t see Thomas’s been threatened by those of us who like a fresh loaf or pasty!!!

  34. Anonymous September 26, 2011 at 8:25 pm #

    Well said Mr. E, what i was saying was hopefully a given but we need to start at 1st base, we may then be able to have regular meetings with Tesco to continue a working relationship to assist the town traders etc in all aspects concerning the well-being of this very special town….your contribution to the debate has been balanced and fair to all parties ……

  35. Anonymous September 27, 2011 at 3:03 pm #

    Re Mr E’s comment about ‘bake off’ – isn’t that exactly what they do a the Kirkbymoorside Thomas’s?

  36. Mr E September 27, 2011 at 3:31 pm #

    I hadnt thought of that. I’m never around the town centre at that time to see how the bread comes into Thomas’s. Maybe naively, I assumed the dough was made fresh daily and then driven over here as fresh finished loaves or even as fresh dough to bake once here?

    For Tesco i am guessing it would more likely come in frozen from a central warehouse and then be finished off in store…but again that’s something to clarify.

  37. Diane Humble September 27, 2011 at 4:21 pm #

    Nothing to do with Tesco but I would like to point out that Baines opening was not behind my reason to close my shop.There is/was room for both of us.Bill Gamble and I managed for years.The reason I closed my shop is simple Roy is 65 and wanted to enjoy a bit of life,he was fed up of getting up at 4am to go to market {in all weathers} After all he did it for 26 years.

  38. Anonymous September 27, 2011 at 8:49 pm #

    Well i think tesco will be a good thing to happen to kirkbymoorside lived here now for 20 years ,they keep building more houses and its time for the town to have a tesco,it would also good for a opticians in kirkbymoorside ,as then people who could not drive wouldnt have to get the bus to pickering ,malton ect.Also it will bring jobs for local people!maybe we could also have a opticians where the White Horse was!

  39. Martin Watts September 27, 2011 at 9:08 pm #

    I have very mixed feelings about a Tesco in Kirkbymoorside, partly because I agree with the comments above (anon 29 September 11 07.56) relating to Tesco’s greed – they want “cat, skin and all”, but also because I do not believe the claim that they will bring trade into the town. The proposed site is not close enough to the centre for that – shoppers will no doubt mostly arrive by car, and having done their shopping will be unlikely in my opinion to carry on up the street to visit the traders in the market place. If, as I fear, this takes trade away from the existing shops I can foresee the character of the town changing for the worse because we lose town centre businesses. The convenience stores are neither of them ideal but provide somewhere to buy basic provisions and in the case of Spar provide a convenient town centre shop for some of the more elderly and less mobile of the town centre residents who will be unable to reach a store at the bottom of Railway Street. As for 100 jobs, I think this is a rather inflated figure. I guess a store of this size would probably employ about ten full time staff and perhaps up to 50 part timers. The local employment would be very welcome to those employed at the store, but is unlikely to live up to the headline figures suggested, and even less likely to bring much financial benefit to the town. (I suspect that quite a large proportion of the part time wages at least would be spent on groceries – at Tesco’s!) Any other benefit to the town in terms of Christmas lights, signage, support for community projects and the like would be most welcome, but forget at your peril that Tesco are not proposing this development with the idea of benefiting the residents of Kirkbymoorside and the surrounding area, but are doing it simply for their own commercial gain regardless of the town, its existing traders and its residents. Nothing more, nothing less.

  40. Anonymous September 27, 2011 at 9:37 pm #

    KMS people need to wake up and smell the coffee, it may give the local businesses a kick up the backside and make more of an effort at their stores…………..everytime i walk into a certain store, i cant help thinking ‘how do they get through Health and Safety by the state of the place’! A bit of competition is always good!!! Kirkbymoorside Town Council are opposed to everything good that happens to KMS….think we need some new Members!!!

  41. Martin Watts September 27, 2011 at 11:17 pm #

    Oh for goodness sake! Lets not start another knock the Town Council competition. They’ve hardly warmed their seats yet, so give them a chance; and for all you posters hiding behind a cloak of anonymity or a pen name, if you do want to say something, especially if it may be considered critical or contentious, please have the decency to put your name to it as I do.

  42. Sian September 28, 2011 at 6:00 pm #

    Just to let those of you know who are wondering about Thomas’ bread: the dough is made fresh every morning (very early morning) by bakers who have been in the bakery at Helmsley overnight, it is then baked and taken straight to the shop while still warm from the oven. Some is baked in the shop, but mostly it has come from the bakery. The bread that doesn’t sell that day will not be sold the next day, it will always be very fresh. On the other hand, Tesco’s ‘bake-off’ where the bread is cooked in store is actually made using par baked dough that will have been frozen for some time until it is ready to be baked in store, so technically is not ‘freshly baked’.

  43. Anonymous September 28, 2011 at 10:42 pm #

    i think its has to be a yes,, how can ppl say we have enough? as a mum i dont have evry thing i need in this town i have been born and bred here a there has neva been enough! as me and every 1 in my family and probably 80% of ppl from kms have to drive to malton or york ect just to get a good shop and not be rippd off wiv spar or coop! we canot cater for all the houses getting built as it is and i think it would be grate! as my grandparents said to day on there low pension they carnt afford some of the essentials in kms so they have 2 send relatives to do there shop els where as they carnt drive, lets face it we need some thing different we have sed it 4 years alot ov the population of kms want bigger supermarket and some where wiv good deals and fairly cheep to shop at…..

  44. Martin Watts September 28, 2011 at 11:06 pm #

    To Anonymous (above) I agree that there is a better choice at the supermarkets at Malton and York than there is at Coop or Spar in KMS, and much more room in the aisles. I shop at Malton myself about once a fortnight, but I would be very wary of arguing that I go there because I can’t afford to shop in KMS. My car doesn’t run on fresh air and at a conservative estimate it costs about £5 every time I go to Malton. You could pay a bit extra for some of the same goods here and still have change from that fiver, although of course you wouldn’t have the same breadth of choice.

  45. Anonymous September 29, 2011 at 3:28 pm #

    I’ve voted ‘yes’ to the Tesco supermarket. There may be other local shops in town, but half the time you can’t buy the type of groceries you want. Not everyone has a car, which a lot of people seem to assume.

  46. Mr E September 29, 2011 at 4:24 pm #

    I don’t know if it’s just me or others have had the same problem but it’s taken me about 24hrs to get this comment posted but it seems awfully quiet on here considering the exhibition has just finished.

    I finally got to the exhibition and to see the plans and too be honest I was a little disappointed with the amount of detailed information, though obviously this might be because it is still a proposal at the pre-planning stage. While still in favour, what I got was that feeling you get when you watch a politician on TV and they sound really nice and interesting but you realise you haven’t really learnt anything new. Does anyone know if more detail will come later or do we have to wait for planning?

    Clearly I was wrong about the bakers, they definitely said they are having a proper bakery with bread being made on site. Re Martin’s comment (27.9.11, 21:08) they told me they have made a commitment (to whom?) to have 100 staff and would be recruiting locally. I was told it would be the same prices as the Thirsk store (the smaller convenience stores are more expensive). I was told they will have a small range of CDs, DVDs and games which may save a trip to Malton, Thirsk or further afield. They said lots of nice things about linking in with and supporting the community, schools and clubs and I think the low profile eco store looked good on the mock ups and with the pedestrian crossing right by the roundabout it can hardly be described as out of town. However, this brings me onto my next point.

    I am concerned about access. I know the car park is only small and the volume of traffic is unlikely to be huge but the A170 is already busy (and worse in summer) and (a) the pedestrian crossing shown is very close to the roundabout, which I guess is good for encouraging shoppers up into town but will it impact traffic flow? Is there analysis available, or will that come at the planning stage? And (b) if you are travelling in eastbound or turning right out of the car park, that looks potentially problematic, many of us have seen what it’s like trying to get into and out of Morrison’s in Malton (which I admit is a different scale of store and town).

    Did anyone have any other thoughts, positive or negative?

  47. Anonymous October 1, 2011 at 3:32 pm #

    Identities
    In light of the comment by Anon on the 27 September 2011 at 22.17 about tracing the identity of people posting on this site, albeit with reference to Tesco employees, perhaps the editor, Gareth, would make a statement about the privacy of people posting and whether he will try to identify users/patterns or not, unless the law requires him to. It will restore confidence in users.

  48. Gareth October 1, 2011 at 8:37 pm #

    Not only am I unable to identify users but even if I could I wouldn’t want to. My preference is always that comments have a name attached and make that request. Indeed as you can see I say that anonymous posts will be deleted but in reality I have not felt the need to do that in this discussion. That stipulation arose from postings that were quite nasty during the Town Library discussion but thankfully things have remained fairly civilised this time around. So as long as the comments posted are largely constructive they’ll stay up. There may well be suspicions that both some comments and voting on the blog may have origins from outside of the town and this may well be the case.

    The conclusion has to be therefore that what we have here may well bear no relation to the actual feelings of the people of this town towards Tesco. Similar caution should of course be applied to any ‘evidence’ Tesco produce from their recent consultation!

    So feel free to comment under whatever title you wish – but please ensure it is a positive contribution.

  49. Gareth October 1, 2011 at 8:46 pm #

    Mr E. – apologies you have had recent problems posting comments on the blog – for some reason those got filed away as spam and I have only just discovered them. I didn’t know blogger had this facility and why it chose your comments. It must have been very frustrating. I’ll now keep an eye on this and repost any that appear. So if your posting doesn’t immediately work give it a little while before you try again.

  50. Mr E October 2, 2011 at 8:30 pm #

    Thanks Gareth, I must admit I was beginning to wonder what was going on and you are right it was very frsutrating.

    I am going to try and post in the comments under the interview and hopefully it will go on without an issue, if not if you would be kind enough to sort it that would be great.

  51. Mark Simpson October 5, 2011 at 4:56 pm #

    Tesco coming to town, good or bad not sure! what i do know is that the parking situation in kirkby is one that needs addressing. If you are local or a visitor coming into town, the first trip up the main street would give you the impression that the town is heaving, but in reality most of the parking spaces are taken up by people working in the businesses in the main street, not just retail ones but also banks etc. If parking spaces were freed up on the cobbles etc, possibly a waiting ristriction of 3hrs and free parking in the town car park, either permits or free parking for all. possible use of Manor Vale council yard as an overflow car park. Then there would be a better turn around of veichels on the cobbles. Lower down the street maybe isnt such a problem i.e below the deli, as these are more residential houses without other options.
    If Tesco do come then the businesses in town need to be active in drawing customers up the street and giving them the oppertunity to stop and use the excellant shops in town, without the stress of trying to find parking places. This is possibly the oppertunity the council need to really show us that they are in touch with the business and residential community of kirkbymoorside.

  52. Alex White October 13, 2011 at 12:36 pm #

    I feel in two minds and can see advantages and disadvantages. It does occur to me, however, that a successful shop could bring a lot of people into town (even if say 25% decide to look round town, that is a big increase in potential trade) Helmsley does not have many shops for locals for instance. Also it may do a great deal to improve the 128 bus service which has withered to almost nothing. So the longer-term effects could be much more beneficial than the short-term fears and worries suggest.

  53. Martin Watts October 16, 2011 at 10:41 am #

    I understand that Tesco and their supporters claim that a store in Kirkbymoorside will bring visitors into the town as Alex (above) suggests but fail to see which other shops they will patronise during their visit to the supermarket. They might just perhaps call at Wainds and buy a bit of decent meat as it seems this will not be catered for at the proposed store, but will they do their main shopping at Tesco, then pop up the town for a few tomatos from Baines, a newspaper from Kirby News, or some shampoo from Towlers? I very much doubt it! The lady from Tescos tried to suggest during the filmed interview seen on this town blog that they would promote other local (competing)stores by advertising in their own supermarket, and that they were not looking to take trade away from Pickering, but both suggestions are ludicrous. Tesco is a commercial entity, driven by corporate greed and will take whatever trade it can, from wherever it can, without worrying for one moment about where it has come from, or how it might affect local communities. Their only concern is how they can grow their business to the point where they can provide the consumer with everything, supplying not only groceries, travel money, mobile phones, electricals and white goods, clothes, household goods, spectacles, prescriptions, petrol, insurance and soon legal services, but also anything else that he/she might demand.

  54. Anonymous November 13, 2011 at 8:37 pm #

    if KMS shop owners are worried, maybe they should give competitive prices on goods/food etc and have shops that tourists would be interested in visiting…

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